Re: Mobile Welsh (was: Mormonides)

[Padraic Brown <agricola@wam.umd.edu>]

On Wed, 28 Jan 1998, Raymond A. Brown wrote:

> [....]
> >all along the West Coast; they landed in Argentina, where to this very
> >day, if one knows Welsh, one can get along in a smashing fashion in such
> >places as the Camwy Valley & Cwm Hyfryd.
> 
> No, no - you're talking about the actual Welsh settlement of Patagonia, now
> part of Argentina, in, I think, the early years of the last century
> [Another date to check :=(   ]

I know this.  It's been a while, but I read a history of the area.  The
date, if I remember aright, is somewhen between 1830 and 1860.  Due to the
Troubles Britain has had with Argentina, the Colony didn't get a whole lot
of support (either from Britain _or_ Argentina).  Try Geraint D. Owen's
"Crisis in Chubut: a chapter in the history of the Welsh colony in
Patagonia", 1977, Swansea.

Perhaps a winkey-smiley should have appeared to alert readers to the
otherwise unmarked humor. :)

> 
> I was talking about the legendary voyage of the Welsh Prince Madog, son of
> Owain Gwynedd, who is supposed to have sailed from Aber-Cerrig-Gwynion near
> Rhos-on-Sea, with two ships in 1170 and to have landed in Mobile Bay,
> Alabama.  I've checked, and the Indian tribe is the Mandans who became
> extinct, I believe, in the mid-19th century.  The Mandans, in fact, were
> held to be the descendants of Madog's followers.

I've never heard this legend.  Yet another Discovery Myth.  Anyway, I
can't find anything here on the Mandans, except that they are Siouans who
now live in chilly North Dakota.  If his highness had made it to the
Mississippi, he would have found any number of rather high civilisations
in the area at this time, especially further north.  I can't guarantee
that the Mandans were in the area at that time, though.  Can you give a
reference for Madog's story? 

> 
> Ray.
> 
Padraic.